IDIOTS AND PROOF >Prove what the OT's cannot, make me belive, asshole, meatball, >dreamball, IDIOT. It is not clear that anyone can make anyone believe in OT, even with obvious demonstration of power, doubts would remain, the person receiving the demonstration would begin to think they were dreaming etc, or they would go on a belief binge, believing in things as if they were certain of them. Just because I can move the marble on command, doesn't mean you KNOW that *I* am moving it. What others can do however is get you to see where you have accepted false certainties that put false doubts in your mind. Once these are cleared out, then you can bubble up to the 50/50 mark where you really and honestly totally just don't know whether you are a dreamball or meatball. The fear level here is quite strong, the choice between wanting to be a meatball or a dreamball might seem like a no brainer, but when dealing with the infinite and its propensity towards Omni Numinousness, it can seem like a quick and eternal death might be the best solution. One has to consider the nature of an immortal dreamball that WOULD or even COULD engage in the dream of being a meatball. That is quite something else if you think about it. At the 50/50 point one finally sees that no one can provide you final proof of anything, because they can't even prove that they exist to you, so what proof can they bring you? Attaining certainty about yourself via actions or observations of others is not functional. At the 50/50 point the only thing you can do is be open to what the AllThatIs has to show you and draw your own conclusions. You are totally alone at that point, because it won't be until after you cross the 50/50 point to the dreamball side that the whole problem of proving other's existence begins to clear up. It will however clear up under a whole new paradigm of what others are, the view we had as meatballs just doesn't hold up and doesn't survive the cross over. Homer